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> 1980 240 Dl Wagon No Start, Engine spins no start up
cklei
post Jul 8 2012, 11:21 PM
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Hello all, before I get started with my problem here are the basics for my car:

1980 240DL Wagon
B21F engine with CIS injection system.
Manual 4sp w/OD

So heres what started it, I was on my way to the store and suddenly the engine just stopped, had electrical, could attempt to start the engine but no fire up. (was able to get it home by coasting it backwards 3 blocks). BTW the tank was half full.

What I've done so far:

1. Checked the fuel pump by jumping the 30 & 87 pins on the fuel pump relay. Fuel pump starts running.
2. Tried a used fuel pump relay (not sure if it work and the guy I bought from didn't know ($5)) no start going to buy a new one this week.
3. Went looking for the 20amp fuse in engine compartment, I believe my model doesn't have that feature. As I looked by the driver's side wheel well and by the coil.

What I'm going to try next:

1. Jump the 5 and 7 fuse conectors to see if engine will start (left side as I've read)
2. Install new fuel pump relay.


What other things should I check?

Any input would be great... Thanks ahead.
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danielm85948
post Jul 9 2012, 12:35 AM
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QUOTE (cklei @ Jul 9 2012, 12:21 AM)
Hello all, before I get started with my problem here are the basics for my car:

1980 240DL Wagon
B21F engine with CIS injection system.
Manual 4sp w/OD

So heres what started it, I was on my way to the store and suddenly the engine just stopped, had electrical, could attempt to start the engine but no fire up. (was able to get it home by coasting it backwards 3 blocks). BTW the tank was half full.

What I've done so far:

1. Checked the fuel pump by jumping the 30 & 87 pins on the fuel pump relay. Fuel pump starts running.
2. Tried a used fuel pump relay (not sure if it work and the guy I bought from didn't know ($5)) no start going to buy a new one this week.
3. Went looking for the 20amp fuse in engine compartment, I believe my model doesn't have that feature. As I looked by the driver's side wheel well and by the coil.

What I'm going to try next:

1. Jump the 5 and 7 fuse conectors to see if engine will start (left side as I've read)
2. Install new fuel pump relay.


What other things should I check?

Any input would be great... Thanks ahead.

check you are getting spark from the coil,then spark to each of the plugs,are you getting fuel to your plugs,smell them,are they wet from the fuel dry them,it can be a dirty throttle body,at the butterfly check and clean it,check for dirty air filter if fuel is not going to the plugs,it can be dirty fuel filter or fuel accumulator but first thing to do is check you have power in your battery,and check for dirty or rusty fuses or fuse contacts.
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cklei
post Jul 16 2012, 12:05 AM
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QUOTE (danielm85948 @ Jul 9 2012, 01:35 AM)
check you are getting spark from the coil,then spark to each of the plugs,are you getting fuel to your plugs,smell them,are they wet from the fuel dry them,it can be a dirty throttle body,at the butterfly check and clean it,check for dirty air filter if fuel is not going to the plugs,it can be dirty fuel filter or fuel accumulator but first thing to do is check you have power in your battery,and check for dirty or rusty fuses or fuse contacts.


Thank You danielm85948, I've checked the fuel pumps and they are working, recently checked the spark and found that there is no spark coming from the spark plug wires when cranking. I do know that the battery is good, the wires are new as of 6 months ago as well as rotor and cap. (had a tune up and oil change when I purchased the car) I checked the ohm on the coil and ballast, that seems correct according to the haynes manual but will be checking it again and spark from the coil. Will be checking plugs for fuel tomorrow. Any advice about lack of spark? I've checked the fuses in the passenger compartment and all seems well there. I haven't found or noticed any in the engine compartment. BTW I'm not sure I mentioned that its a fuel injected model not carburetored.

I have noted that it is a breakerless ignition system, and I believe its a CIS K-Jetronic system. If that info helps.
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danielm85948
post Jul 16 2012, 02:41 AM
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QUOTE (cklei @ Jul 16 2012, 12:05 AM)
Thank You danielm85948, I've checked the fuel pumps and they are working, recently checked the spark and found that there is no spark coming from the spark plug wires when cranking. I do know that the battery is good, the wires are new as of 6 months ago as well as rotor and cap. (had a tune up and oil change when I purchased the car) I checked the ohm on the coil and ballast, that seems correct according to the haynes manual but will be checking it again and spark from the coil. Will be checking plugs for fuel tomorrow. Any advice about lack of spark? I've checked the fuses in the passenger compartment and all seems well there. I haven't found or noticed any in the engine compartment. BTW I'm not sure I mentioned that its a fuel injected model not carburetored.

I have noted that it is a breakerless ignition system, and I believe its a CIS K-Jetronic system. If that info helps.

sounds like you coil has gone, replace it,but before you do so ,check you are getting power from turning on and off your ignition switch check at the wires at the coil, so ignition switch on ,is there power to both those wires ,if no then it is the electrical part of the ignition switch that is failed.
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cklei
post Jul 16 2012, 10:23 PM
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QUOTE (danielm85948 @ Jul 16 2012, 03:41 AM)
sounds like you coil has gone, replace it,but before you do so ,check you are getting power from turning on and off your ignition switch check at the wires at the coil, so ignition switch on ,is there power to both those wires ,if no then it is the electrical part of the ignition switch that is failed.


danielm85948
Bingo on the coil, checked everything you pointed out. Ordered a new one will keep you posted thank you for the help.
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robert240
post Jul 17 2012, 04:21 PM
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Check your timing belt, you won't have spark if your camshaft isn't turning.
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Vermont
post Jul 17 2012, 05:08 PM
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deleted . . . . accidentally got duped below.

This post has been edited by Vermont: Jul 17 2012, 05:43 PM
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Vermont
post Jul 17 2012, 05:26 PM
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QUOTE (robert240)
Check your timing belt, you won't have spark if your camshaft isn't turning.

Yeah . . . . and now you'll have a lot of other new things to go with your new Timing Belt.
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danielm85948
post Jul 17 2012, 08:47 PM
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QUOTE (Vermont @ Jul 17 2012, 05:26 PM)
Yeah . . . . and now you'll have a lot of other new things to go with your new Timing Belt.

as that is a red block engine up to 1993 so if the timing belt has gone as Robert says,it is a safe engine as it it a non interface engine,so you would line up the timing marks and change the timing belt,just take off your oil cap ,look in and see if the camshaft is turning if it is, the timing belt is ok.
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cklei
post Jul 26 2012, 01:39 PM
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QUOTE (danielm85948 @ Jul 17 2012, 09:47 PM)
as that is a red block engine up to 1993 so if the timing belt has gone as Robert says,it is a safe engine as it it a non interface engine,so you would line up the timing marks and change the timing belt,just take off your oil cap ,look in and see if the camshaft is turning if it is, the timing belt is ok.


Thanks for all the input, here is the story so far. I did need to replace the timing belt as it had a 4 inch section of teeth completely chewed off will take a pic later and post just for history's sake. Installed new belt and tried the initial timing test of starting the car before sealing everything back up and still no start. I have fuel, spark and still nothing. Will be going back to check wires at the coil to make sure its not an ignition issue there later today.(note I did replace the coil) I'm stumped so any input on what to start looking for would be great.
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danielm85948
post Jul 26 2012, 09:47 PM
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QUOTE (cklei @ Jul 26 2012, 01:39 PM)
Thanks for all the input, here is the story so far. I did need to replace the timing belt as it had a 4 inch section of teeth completely chewed off will take a pic later and post just for history's sake. Installed new belt and tried the initial timing test of starting the car before sealing everything back up and still no start. I have fuel, spark and still nothing. Will be going back to check wires at the coil to make sure its not an ignition issue there later today.(note I did replace the coil) I'm stumped so any input on what to start looking for would be great.

as you have done the timing belt,i take it your timing marks were set up ok,and your firing order is set up ok,now you have to check the dwell angle in your distributor is correct,do you know how that is done.
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cklei
post Jul 26 2012, 09:53 PM
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QUOTE (danielm85948 @ Jul 26 2012, 09:47 PM)
as you have done the timing belt,i take it your timing marks were set up ok,and your firing order is set up ok,now you have to check the dwell angle in your distributor is correct,do you know how that is done.


No not at all, I'm a total beginner backyard mechanic. I do have 3 repair guides chilton and haynes. Any info would be great, wasn't sure I was going to have to mess with the distributor.
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danielm85948
post Jul 27 2012, 04:05 AM
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QUOTE (cklei @ Jul 26 2012, 09:53 PM)
No not at all, I'm a total beginner backyard mechanic. I do have 3 repair guides chilton and haynes. Any info would be great, wasn't sure I was going to have to mess with the distributor.

to do the basic set up for your distributor,take out your number one spark plug that is the first one next to the fan,now turn your crankshaft by hand so you can feel with a long screw driver in that hole that the piston is at top dead centre,now take off the cap on your distributor you can now see your rotor arm,the tip of it should line up with the cut out in the body of your distributor the top of it,if it is not ,then the bolt holding your distributor on you need to loosen it to adjust the distributor,so that both the tip of your rotor arm is pointing to the cut out in the body of your distributor,that is only the basic adjustment to get the car to run,you need a strobe light to adjust the dwell angle and to set your timing,just google setting up your timing for your volvo you will then get the details needed ,err when i say turn by hand i mean you need a socket on the nut on your crankshaft pulley wheel .i take it before you do any of this work ,that your belt has been fitted correctly and that all your timing marks all lined up when the car was set

This post has been edited by danielm85948: Jul 27 2012, 05:29 AM
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cklei
post Jul 27 2012, 12:53 PM
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QUOTE (danielm85948 @ Jul 27 2012, 05:05 AM)
to do the basic set up for your distributor,take out your number one spark plug that is the first one next to the fan,now turn your crankshaft by hand so you can feel with a long screw driver in that hole that the piston is at top dead centre,now take off the cap on your distributor you can now see your rotor arm,the tip of it should line up with the cut out in the body of your distributor the top of it,if it is not ,then the bolt holding your distributor on you need to loosen it to adjust the distributor,so that both the tip of your rotor arm is pointing to the cut out in the body of your distributor,that is only the basic adjustment to get the car to run,you need a strobe light to adjust the dwell angle and to set your timing,just google setting up your timing for your volvo you will then get the details needed ,err when i say turn by hand i mean you need a socket on the nut on your crankshaft pulley wheel .i take it before you do any of this work ,that your belt has been fitted correctly and that all your timing marks all lined up when the car was set


Thank you for the instructions, I was afraid of that but will do. I'm going to wait as I really need to replace the cam and crank seals as its halfway apart anyway. Will keep you posted on my progress. As I see no point in doing all of the above just to do it twice.
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danielm85948
post Jul 28 2012, 03:21 AM
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QUOTE (cklei @ Jul 27 2012, 12:53 PM)
Thank you for the instructions, I was afraid of that but will do. I'm going to wait as I really need to replace the cam and crank seals as its halfway apart anyway. Will keep you posted on my progress. As I see no point in doing all of the above just to do it twice.

I did a rebuild of that very same engine about 25 years ago,like you I knew nothing about doing it, so I read up on it,to find out what to do,i changed the bearings on the crankshaft I started work on a Friday taking out the engine,then taken it apart I noted what I did as I was doing so, I had it rebuilt on Monday, and to check all my work I did a run of 700 miles in two days doing 350 miles on the Tuesday and the same again on the Wednesday it ran perfect like a new car I learned a lot by doing it and it was fun to do it on my own,so find out as much as you can before doing any work,just Google each step
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cklei
post Aug 2 2012, 11:41 PM
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QUOTE (danielm85948 @ Jul 28 2012, 03:21 AM)
I did a rebuild of that very same engine about 25 years ago,like you I knew nothing about doing it, so I read up on it,to find out what to do,i changed the bearings on the crankshaft I started work on a Friday taking out the engine,then taken it apart I noted what I did as I was doing so, I had it rebuilt on Monday, and to check all my work I did a run of 700 miles in two days doing 350 miles on the Tuesday and the same again on the Wednesday it ran perfect like a new car I learned a lot by doing it and it was fun to do it on my own,so find out as much as you can before doing any work,just Google each step


Thanks for the inspiration, so wish I could pull and rebuild the engine, and will be doing allot of research for each step of the process. After this comes fluid replacement of the transmission and new struts, so my fun and drinking money are spoken for. I love my car its my second 240 wagon the first being a 1982. I've been eye balling what looks like a 1978-79 242 kind want to see if the owner wants to part with it.

Will keep you posted.
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cklei
post Aug 21 2012, 07:05 PM
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So here's the update, finally was able to get my cam seal yesterday and began the replacement today. During my removal of the cam wheel I had a small piece of metal fall into my hand. Turns out it the little key tub on the cam. So here's the question. Do I now have to replace my camshaft or that piece of metal which was hollow? Everything was going well until I made that discovery during reassembly.
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cklei
post Aug 21 2012, 07:26 PM
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QUOTE (cklei @ Aug 21 2012, 08:05 PM)
So here's the update, finally was able to get my cam seal yesterday and began the replacement today. During my removal of the cam wheel I had a small piece of metal fall into my hand. Turns out it the little key tub on the cam. So here's the question. Do I now have to replace my camshaft or that piece of metal which was hollow? Everything was going well until I made that discovery during reassembly.


After a little research I discovered that I can replace the pin, that it sheering of is common. IPD USA sells a solid replacement pin for this so I will be taking care of a few other items until I can order the part. Any ideas on how I might get the old pin out, tried to get at it with needle nose but not enough left to get a hold of. Thanks Ahead of time for reading.
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cklei
post Sep 19 2012, 04:49 PM
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After 2 months and kind advice from everyone here on the boards, I was able to drive my car today. These are the items that where replaced.

Timing belt
Ignition Coil
Fire Trap (while I was there)
Air filter ( while I was there)
Cam Seal
Tensioner
Cam key pin (sheered of during removal of the cam fly-wheel)
And the throttle cable (discovered it was broken at the throttle pulley)
Parts= $100-$150

Tools
timing gun
dwell/amp/and tachometer (used from a goodwill for $8)
distributor wrench

Total Tools=$30

Total= about $200

Far less than a shop would have charged.

So thanks again for everyone's help, next project replacing the transmission fluid, and front struts (going to pay someone for the struts, that project I find scary).

Have a great day.
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robert240
post Sep 20 2012, 11:12 AM
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(IMG:style_emoticons/default/thumbsup.gif)

My 86 240 has been parked for awhile with a bad head gasket, but seeing it everyday (parked) gives me slight motivation to visit here (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

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