There's nothing for it, xpiece - just get the rusty old tools out and start DIY'ing :).

Turned out that God was in a weird mood and decided to let it snow this weekend, so my initiative has been postponed by a couple of days due to temperatures (brrrr).


<OFFTOPIC>
Right on the money, Ampang: My 850 has been mistreated so bad by the previous owner, for some time I thought he wouldn't make it (the car, that is)!

As we all know Volvo's are known for reliability and sturdiness. This is a reputation it gained back in the days, especially during the 240 series. But I think people have got this whole thing a little bit wrong - Volvos of today are cars that really do need to have their services and routine maintenance followed. If not the car will fall apart after some time (like most cars). The reason why Volvos have gained the rep of a cheap and reliable workhorse was simply because it was simple and cheap to repair it yourself when it (eventually) fell apart (esp 240). And as we all know; it did indeed fall apart. Ever since the 850, which was a very advanced car in the time of its introduction, things have changed. It's not that easy to DIY anymore unless you've got spacetools, laserwrenches, optic screwdrivers and whatnot... Sad. Sometimes I miss my old 242 :)

Oh what the hell am I going on about here? Man I am going to bed now, been awake for a looong time. Oh yeah the point was: Don't think that your car can handle mistreatment and beating just because it's a Volvo - it will break down, trust me.
</OFFTOPIC>

C ya!

Hear! Hear! :beer:

For now, let's go for a stroll... :auto:

Mine goes to the shop tomorrow. New mechanic, hes very confident he can find the problem.
Mat

Let's hope so too.
:)

Let's hope he's got some fresh ideas!

I'm going to measure some voltages here and there today to try and determine if the fuel pump is shot.

Oh and by the way mealx:
Try to have someone press down the fuel pump relay when your hot start problem is present. I discovered that 9/10 times it would start in my case, so I tried to put a bottle cap under the relay cover to put pressure on it. I drove the engine warm to make sure the problem was present, and stopped/started it several times to see if it really helped. I nearly *** my pants when the damn thing seemed to work just fine the first 5-10 attempts. But after that the effect seemed to wear off gradually. I'm starting to wonder if the socket the relay connects to might be a little bit quirky. If so it would explain why a lot of people don't get completely rid of their problems even after changing a lot of parts.

I don't know what to make of it and I know it sounds ridiculous, but I just thought you might wanna try it anyway :)

Well I've been out fiddling around with the car today.

Removed the floor covers in the trunk and got access to the fuel pump and the wires that feeds it. Connected a voltmeter to the wires and did some tests.

When the engine is idleing the pump gets ca 13,25-13,40 volts. I didn't rev the engine to any more than about 2500 RPM's, and the voltage never exceeded 13,40 during tests. I don't know if this is how it's supposed to be, but it seems probable.

Drove around for a bit until the engine got warmed up and turned it off in order to provoke the warm-start problem. Found out that my fuel pump is probably NOT bad. With the fuel pump relay in place the pump wouldn't get any power, except for some times when it seemed as if a very small trickle of electricity would reach it, allowing it to pump briefly. When this occured the car would stutter and die after about 1-2 seconds of rough, low-RPM running.

The relay has four connectors; 31, 31b, 15 and 87. Putting a jumper wire between the sockets corresponding to relay connectors number 15 and 87 and turning on the ignition made the pump go and the engine would run. Replacing the jumper with the relay would restore the problem. Aha. This leaves me 99% sure that the relay is ready for replacement.

But: Since I've read so many horror stories about people replacing all kinds of parts with no luck I think I'll do the following later on:
Unplug the relay and put wires from every connector on it to the corresponding socket and measure the currents to make absolutely certain that the relay is in fact bad. If I don't do this I'll probably replace it only to find out that the problem really was in one of the components that connects to the relay, since that is the kind of luck I usually have with things :)

Replacing the relay will probably rid me of the warm-start issues, but i wonder if it would have any effect on the stalling-while-driving problem I sometimes have experienced. Anyone care to make an educated guess?

Oh and here's some pics, just for the heck of it. Could be someone out there thinking about doing something similar for fault-tracing.
The small grey harness is the easiest spot for measuring the power to the pump.
Also keep in mind that when using a jumper in the relay socket the pump will run continuosly, so you probably shouldn't let it run for too long. It'll probably smell gas after ca 5-7 seconds. (Don't really know if caution is necessary, but better safe than sorry).

(IMG:http://kjell.is-a-geek.com/volvoforums/bilde075.jpg)

(IMG:http://kjell.is-a-geek.com/volvoforums/bilde076.jpg)

Mech called a few hours later said it was definitely the FPR, I had codes for the CMP sensor and he reset them, never to show up again. I replaced it but never reset the codes hehe. Anyway the part comes Friday he also cleaned up some stuff like the MAF with special cleaner etc. Hopefully this fixes the problem. I had my friend (if you remember) rebuild it and it fixed the problem for a long time but he said it was basically toasted all together. All volvo lovers please cross your fingers for me, or this car is hitting the road and im getting a new b.i.t.c.h. to drive. That 84 240 that is MINT and everything is new on it is still down the road. EVERYTHING is new, seats, engine, tranny, susp, lights, paint its sexy.

Thanks, Bakern!
:)

*Crossing fingers* :)

hey piece, just slaughtered a goat to the old gods for you. man, fresh air, a toga, some slaughter, the old lady next door calling the cops. just like in the old country :grin: now where is that damn voodoo doll?

Hi!

I've found a solution to the problem of the erratic starts (usually when hot) for my 2000 C70 cab 2.3 manual.

After trying all the sensors and resetting the codes, it turns out that there was a problem in the anti-theft system. The RFID antenna located in the ignition (part #9442961) that detects the chip embedded in the key. As it didn't read the chip, the immobilizer kills the ignition and the engine just turns over without starting.

I hope this helps and thanks for all the info!

So it was the Fuel Pump Relay.. ahhhemmm :haha: :beer: well now, I been driving a 5 speed for a month now and I feel as now I cant go back to an automatic. So I am probably going to sell the car as soon as I find something, but who knows, I might not. Or I might get another 850. Who knows? Greek, you make me laugh. :haha: Oh yeah mech said it was just cutting in and out. the power to the fpr.

and people used to say i was good for nothing. hey, i make the piece-man laugh. now where is my second grade teacher with that F for not getting along with others?

You got an F...? I mean she gave you an F for that subject?
Like she must be really angry at you, bro.
:)

One thing I forgot to add. One of the joints on the capacitors my friend replaced in the FPR was broken, which is why it would only work sometimes because it would probably vibrate back into place when trying to start the engine.

I am going to get him to fix the piece again and store that one in the glove box for emergencies. This time I am going to make him remove all the solder from those two capacitors and start clean.

Its just difficult cause surprisingly it is a double sided circuit board and made very very well, with very strong solder. We used silver solder but some reason it snapped and hes an electrician.

Hi Folks,
My 1995 850Turbo has the same issue. About 3 weeks ago, it wouldn't start after a lot of stop and start driving (running errands.) After a few minutes, it started up fine and ran fine until a few days ago.
Friday, I was just coming off the highway, and it started to sputter and loose power, then died on the ramp. I was really low on fuel, so I thought I was out of gas. It did start back up, so I immediately pulled into a gas station and topped up. No more problems until today, about 3 days. On my way to work It seemd to miss briefly but then picked back up. I had a Dr. appointment, so I parked and went in. about 45 minutes later, it started right up and I drove the remaining couple of miles to work. once in the lot, it stalled. I rolled into a spot, then started it back up. it started OK, but stalled after less than a minute. It wouldn't restart after that. I let it sit a couple minutes and tried again, and it started right up. Then I parked it and came in to work. (Which is where I am now. :grin: )

The plugs have less than 1000miles on them, as I changed them out a month ago.
No warning lights have lit on any of these occasions.
I didn't replace the plug wires, but they appear to be in good condition (I haven't checked them in the dark though)
I'm glad to see that I'm not the only one with this issue.
I love this car, so I want to fix it.
My thoughts, based on other engines that I've worked on is that the coil is worn. This is my guess because it only seems to happen after the car has been running for a while in warm weather.
I'll replace it this afternoon.

I appreciate all the info here.
Thanks!
Patrick (dayton, OH USA)

Keep us posted. Lets see...

Well after researching here and on another volvo site, I decided to try changing the fuel pump relay and clean out the throttle body. That seems to have done the trick. It seems to be running a lot stronger, and smoother and hasn't stalled or refused to start. (Crossing fingers)
One thing that was immediately noticable was smoother downshifting on the highway. Previously it seemed that if I was on a decline on the highway the car would slow down roughly, sort of like engine breaking in a manual transmission car. I figured that this was due to the fact that the car is way overdue for a transmission flush and filter change. Now I'm pretty certain that the engine was actually stalling and restarting momentarily, as it drives smooth as silk now. I also have experienced lower RPMs for the same highway speeds, and my mileage seems to have increased a little.
It's only been a few days though, I'll cross my fingers and keep you all informed if it resurfaces.
Cheers,
Pat

Good to hear that, Pat.

It's been a long time since I posted anything on the forum, but I just thought I'd mention that my problem has been solved by replacing the fuel pump relay.

I did what I said I'd do a couple of posts up in this thread: Put wires between the relay connectors and the socket, thus allowing me to have the relay in the coupe with me while driving. Quickly found out that by shaking it a little it would click on and off like crazy, which would explain why the engine seemed to have a tendency to stall when driving on rough roads. Oh well I'll find out when the snow comes once again and the road gets really bumpy from lorries driving on it with chains.

Anyways; after replacing it with a used relay I haven't had any problems at all :)
To others doing the same replacement: Remember to get the RED replacement relay (I think the last two digits in the part number is 25).

Man is it great to be able to use the car again!
Thank you all so much for input and help on this issue!